More US Dead in Iraq than on 9/11

[Doug]

(CNN) -- As the fifth anniversary of the September 11, 2001, attack on the United States approaches, another somber benchmark has just been passed.

The announcement Sunday of four more U.S. military deaths in Iraq raises the death toll to 2,974 for U.S. military service members in Iraq and in what the Bush administration calls the war on terror.

The 9/11 attack killed 2,973 people, including Americans and foreign nationals but excluding the terrorists. The 9/11 death toll was calculated by CNN.

See here.

[Dardedar]

The headline or summary (I read it at truthout.org) from this article was worded poorly. Just to be clear, the 2,974 refers to Iraq and Afganistan. No doubt we will pass the 2,974 dead soldiers in Iraq soon enough. And probably 100 times that many Iraqi's, if we haven't already.

[Barbara Fitzpatrick]

We've already passed the 2974 - the counts given out for dead soldiers in Iraq are only combat dead. It doesn't count combat wounded who died later, accidents, murders, suicides (which is higher than the statistical average), and so forth. It is, of course the policy of this Administration to not N*O*T*I*C*E the number of Iraqi dead (nor that the Taliban is taking Afganistan back and the poppy harvest this year is the biggest ever - some 30% greater that global usage, which lower the prices somewhat. Just what we need, cheaper heroin).

[Dardedar]

We've already passed the 2974 - the counts given out for dead soldiers in Iraq are only combat dead. It doesn't count combat wounded who died later,...

DAR
That's a bit of a myth going around. Note:

***
The following is a list of U.S. Fatalities who have died in hospitals in Germany and The United States. Some have claimed that The Department of Defense does not report these deaths, they are obviously mistaken.
Note: these deaths are included in our overall totals.
***

See:

http://icasualties.org/oif/Dow.aspx

[Barbara Fitzpatrick]

You may be (probably are - you're noted for it) correct. I know the military keeps track of all their personnel, killed or wounded, and where - but the numbers announced to the press for "Iraqi Freedom" are not necessarily the same thing as the complete set of data DOD collects.

[Dardedar]

DAR
Thanks for the compliment.

I think this could count as another war myth we could use. I know I heard it somewhere and passed it along too, at least to Doug. But I was always a little suspicious because it seems to me that if there were parents of sons and daughters that were wounded in combat in Iraq, who died after from those wounds, but they were not reported as Iraq war casualities, there would be HELL to pay. It would be such a collosal distortion and lie even by pentagon and Bush standards.

But it's not true. If you see the link I gave above, those who are wounded in Iraq but die after (shortly I suppose, usually in Germany) they are counted as Iraq war casualties.

If there is some evidence showing otherwise I would like to see it.

Oh, I have a way to check. I just read a powerful article about a guy who was wounded very badly with shrapnel through the brain. His parents finally pulled the plug. I'll see if he is counted as an Iraq war casuality. He was wounded April 26 but died May 5 after they stopped his assisted breathing. There wasn't much left, they had removed his frontal lobe. There is no question his death was a result of Iraq war combat.

Here is the article:

http://www.truthout.org/docs_2006/090906G.shtml

His name is: Matthew J. Fenton

Woo... I don't see his name on the DOD list.

http://icasualties.org/oif/BY_DOD.aspx

Barbara, you are vindicated. This is a bit of a mess. Perhaps they would say it is because of the technicality that his parents pulled the plug rather than have a vegetable on a machine for all time?

I'll have to investigate further....

D.

[Dardedar]

DAR
Hmmm, did a search and found him:

ID
2640

DATE
05/06/06

Fenton, Matthew J. Sergeant 24 U.S. Marine 1st BN, 25th Marine REG, 4th Marine DIV Hostile - hostile fire Al Anbar Province Little Ferry New Jersey US

****

DoD Identifies Marine Casualty

The Department of Defense announced today the death of a Marine who was supporting Operation Iraqi Freedom.

Sgt. Matthew J. Fenton, 24, of Little Ferry, N.J., died May 5 at National Naval Medical Center, Bethesda, Md., from wounds received while conducting combat operations against enemy forces in Al Anbar province, Iraq on April 26. He was assigned to Marine Forces Reserve’s Inspector and Instructor Staff, 1st Battalion, 25th Marine Regiment, 4th Marine Division, Fort Devens, Mass.

Media with questions about this Marine can call the 1st Battalion, 25th Marine Regiment Public Affairs Representative at (978) 796-2839.

[Barbara Fitzpatrick]

So is he on the list now? Or is it the situation as I had unstood it - the DoD keeps tabs on all military personnel, but the subset of "official" Iraqi dead is separate - and edited for lower numbers.

[Dardedar]

So is he on the list now?

DAR
He is on the list now. But guess what? I don't think he was on the list the other day. This article just written by his father has been going around. Now he is on the list. Hmmmm....

Or is it the situation as I had unstood it - the DoD keeps tabs on all military personnel, but the subset of "official" Iraqi dead is separate - and edited for lower numbers.

DAR
Not sure what you mean by "Iraqi" dead. I really don't know now. I do find it hard to believe, or unlikely, that they would be fudging the numbers in a big way not because I trust them but because I think they would get caught. But I really don't know now. I don't see why there should have been a delay until now for a fellow that died May 6. Maybe there was some question because his parents technically pulled the plug. Technically, they let him go, so he's on some line.

D.

[Barbara Fitzpatrick]

Off hand, I'd say they've BEEN caught and that's why people who weren't on the list are starting to show up.

[Dardedar]

Then the number of people listed at this link should start going up. They are list by date of death and names are given. As is a total.


http://icasualties.org/oif/BY_DOD.aspx

[odahcamla]

I stumbled upon this site while searching for news regarding my good friend Sgt Fenton. Regarding the publishing and recording of US casualties in Iraq I can verify that his death was announced by the DOD at least within two days of his passing, because I was searching online immediately after I found out. He was also listed on CNN's list of casualties that you referenced. Also, I'd like to add that the cold manner in which you referred to his eventual state as "a vegetable on a machine" is disrespectful. I'm sure his mother and father check the web on a regular basis to see what is being said about their son and if I was able to find it by simply googling "Matthew J Fenton" then I'm sure they'll come across it eventually. Everyone is aware of the reality of the situation, however if you were marching behind his casket during his procession I'm sure the words "vegetable" would have never come out of your mouth. I'm glad to see the impact of his father's letter reaching across the nation and I commend you all for taking the time to think about what is really going on. Just remember that this is someone's gut wrentching reality until they die, don't undermind the memory of a good man with careless comments.
Sgt M
USMC

[Dardedar]

...the cold manner in which you referred to his eventual state as "a vegetable on a machine" is disrespectful.

DAR
I am sorry you found it disrespectful, I didn't intend for it to be. And thanks for adding your thoughts.

D.
----------------------------
veg‧e‧ta‧ble

4. Informal. a person who is so severely impaired mentally or physically as to be largely incapable of conscious responses or activity.